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Southport - support or betrayal?
#91
The point about volunteering is that you do not have to do it. True community participation is not restricted to those who are physically fit enough or can afford the time turn up all day in rotten weather. If you are restricting who is taking part then ask yourself is it free labour labour you are after or community involvement? I would never question the dedication of volunteers but if they are not to become an exclusive group then they, will need guidance and commitment from professionals (paid or not) . If you are a volunteer working on a project ask your self is this opportunity available to any who wants to take part or is only for those who can commit to a set time and set amount of work if so you might be being exploited for your labour rather than being invited to take part in an exciting project. Think about it next time you take part in a project as a volunteer.
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#92
well pdurdin, whilst you demonstrate some of Wax' n Kevin's admirable 'live for archaeology' credo, i would guess that many on this forum will view you as having a goats head.
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#93
Wax Wrote:The point about volunteering is that you do not have to do it. True community participation is not restricted to those who are physically fit enough or can afford the time turn up all day in rotten weather. If you are restricting who is taking part then ask yourself is it free labour labour you are after or community involvement? I would never question the dedication of volunteers but if they are not to become an exclusive group then they, will need guidance and commitment from professionals (paid or not) . If you are a volunteer working on a project ask your self is this opportunity available to any who wants to take part or is only for those who can commit to a set time and set amount of work if so you might be being exploited for your labour rather than being invited to take part in an exciting project. Think about it next time you take part in a project as a volunteer.

so do you leave rubbish on the street to ensure the work of a street sweeper?
do you fix your own car or take it to the garage to be worked on by a professional?
do you decorate your house?
do you mow your own lawn?
do you know what you just said?
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#94
Archaeology for all means exactly that but to implement it requires input from trained people amateurs and professionals. Some of us need to ask themselves if what they are really thinking off is archaeology for me :face-stir:
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#95
P I do not understand what you are getting at. What I am trying to say is that public participation in archaeology should be thought through and inclusive not ad hoc invitation to a chosen few ( cause they can shift a bit of dirt) .
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#96
Wax Wrote:The point about volunteering is that you do not have to do it.
No. The point about volunteering is that you are willing and interested enough to spend your time and money to (help) accomplish a goal. Sure, you don't risk losing your job if you don't turn up, but there's not much point volunteering if you're not gonna do it now, is there?
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#97
I suspect that this may not be a popular view, but it's never been entirely clear to me why volunteers would want to work on the majority of professional-run sites. Sure, there will always be a few fantastic sites excavated on a commercial basis (and I've happily worked alongside volunteers on some sites like this), but my impression is that most professional archaeological contractors spend most of their time undertaking evaluations that may not find anything, or dodging heavy plant on development sites while trying to record whatever scrappy features may have survived subsequent development while the developer whinges about the cost and delay. Whereas an archaeology society can pick a decent example of a particular site-type, approach the landowner for permission, and excavate it, knowing from the outset that they're virtually certain to find decent archaeology. While I can understand the desire to be involved in the best-preserved or most high-profile commercial excavations, I reckon that if you took a random sample of ten commercial excavations and ten society excavations, a higher proportion of the volunteer excavations would be taking place on interesting sites with decent preservation, simply because local societies are able to select where and what they want to dig, rather than only being able to work in areas where development is proposed.:face-stir:
You know Marcus. He once got lost in his own museum
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#98
Marcus Brody Wrote:...it's never been entirely clear to me why volunteers would want to work on the majority of professional-run sites.
It's an opportuniy to learn valuable skills and knowledge, to make connections with other archaeologists, and to gain experience in the commercial environment. (obviously I can only speak for myself)
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#99
pdurdin Wrote:It's an opportuniy to learn valuable skills and knowledge, to make connections with other archaeologists, and to gain experience in the commercial environment. (obviously I can only speak for myself)

Takes us back full circle to the heart of the matter the only really good training and on the job experience for the want to be archaeologist graduate or not is volunteering . What hope do we have to be taken seriously as profession if the powers that be whoever they are do not invest in professional training :face-crying: I shall now withdraw
bye


I am off
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So I think to move this debate on... in fact to move it to the consultation... for as has rightly been said, it is for us to decide.

A new thread. Southport Consultation for people to have their say on a constructive response.

I understand the anger of the 'volunteer' I think what is being suggested is that volunteers cannot replace a paid workforce, and I am sure they would not want that too... I enjoy working on volunteer digs, because.. yes.... I am with people who are keen as mustard. We are just concerned that volunteers are used to replace professionals. So that could be the first part of the response... WE are not against volunteers on site, as they contribute greatly to the project, asn with a rota, the management of numbers can be easily done, but we will not accept volunteers replacing paid field staff for any commercial project.
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