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making it up
As opposed to just talking about them?

It depends on definitions - and I think I was being sloppy with mine! (mea culpe)

To address an issue I meant discuss the problem, agree on the causes of the problem, discuss soultions, decide on best solution(s) and formulate a strategy to get those solutions implemented, and then do those actions. And there have already been many conferences and reports (think APPAG) which cover these areas.

The point is that whilst conferences can be very useful, they complement any strategy to improove thigs, and should not be seen as a goal in their own right.

I personally think that it would be a shame if the oppertunity of the BAJR conference just ended in 150 archaeologists telling each other how bad things are and were, in a kind of '150 yorkshiremen sketch'
which to my mind would fail to address any issues, and hardlyconstitute action
I refer the subscriber to at least the last years worth of dialogue on this forum.Just to nudge you along a bit Tile Man...
Subscribers of all flavours have entered into open dialogue on many issues lately.The conference will see us all take the next step.Please do`nt make the mistake of imagining that BAJR consists of a random flock of misinformed muppets.One would imagine that members of a certain organisation would welcome a pro-active stand to the issues that face us all.Clearly not.The conferences and reports "APPAG" etc you mention have achieved what exactly?
This thread was offered to enable discussion relating to frankly inept report-writing and the lack of "monitoring" of such.Rather than belittle endeavours of subscribers here and,consistantly wave the flag of an organisation close to your heart-do you actually have anything positive to offer?

..knowledge without action is insanity and action without knowledge is vanity..(imam ghazali,ayyuhal-walad)
I was under the impression that this thread started as a general accusation that there were a number of faked reports out there. I think there is a clue in the title.

You have made it clear that you feel so strongly about the current situation in archaeology that you you will go to any lengths short of actual action. That does not stop you continuing an incessent stream of snide commenst on any organisation which is actually doing anything!

I was pointing out that a conference does not neccessarily constitute action, but can be useful, but everyone agreeing the same things about how bad things are and repeating the APPAG conclusions does not necessarily bring us forward.

You are asking what positive things I can contribute? Well I was asking on another thread about what others definitions of field skills were as part of the debate on validation - as a good processialist I like to debate using definitions and facts. That thread got drowned in a load of invective based on unsubstantiated claims about the competence of members of the IFA.

Another thing I have been flagging up is the threat to local curatorial services . Without these there is no monitering, and indeed no archaeological condition on a planning application in the first place. I cannot think of any bigger threat to the professional asperations of archaeologists - no archaeological condition, no archaeological work.

My own solutions are pretty clear- I can lobby my representatives as a constituent, and can engage within the political party of which I am an occasional activist. I also choose to support collectibve action through a union which has managed to get positive results in the past, and I hope will start communicating better in the near future. My main work is with the IFA -again I feel a strong professional asociation is a good way of lobbying the government and organisations to show that we are not just wanting to dig holes and get paid for out hobby, but a serious profession with asperations of career developemnt and with a very strong case for being paid more.

Making the case for being paid more includes demonstrating what therequired skills are for differnt parts of the profession ( see kates post) but also providing the structures so that pay can be raised signifiacantly above infaltion to get us in line with comparible professions - which is something which needs to be based on a common baseline for employment to begin with, and has to take place over the long term, something which I think could be speeded up by union and iFA membership.

As a finds specialist I am prioritising my own long term aspirations of pay and development by concentrating on what needs to be improoved for finds people - something which I would be more than happy detail if you think it relevent?
from Tile Man, commenting on Troll:
Quote:quote:That does not stop you continuing an incessent stream of snide commenst on any organisation which is actually doing anything!

Tile Man, I think that on most of the actual issues in this debate I agree with you and I strongly disagree with Troll. However, he has strong, honestly held opinions (no matter how misguided I think they are), and I don't think it helps to make personal comments of this sort.

Apart from being a bad idea in itself, it doesn't help you win the argument. You can't persuade people to come round to your own point of view if you start by making them hostile.


to let, fully furnished
1man1desk (and troll) you're right - Apologies! in mitigation it was early in the morning and I was feeling grumpy, but no real excuse...Smile
Thanks Tile Man... an apology such as that is worthy and honourable.

Another day another WSI?
In compensation I have put up a draft of my analysis of improving pay for people to comment on...


to let, fully furnished
Ooops - found it. Very useful analysis, and I agreed with almost every word.


to let, fully furnished

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