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IfA Now have a policy on Self Employment
quick answer YES, YES and YES
[SIZE=3]c) Although it is up to a person how much the charge themselves out at, it has to be remembered that the less they charge, the less others charge, then they will have to charge even less.... etc. Like Employed rates, I strongly believe that there should also be SE minima below which you don't go, as it will harm all of us in the long term.

This is illegal. It is exactly the same as companies getting together to set any rate.

How I see the situation is that one archaeologist needs other archaeologist to undertake field work. What we need are explicit agreements that maintain the integrity of both archaeologists so that there can be no confusion that one is employing the other but rather that it is the owner of the archaeology who is paying individual archaeologists to undertake the excavation and interpretation.
Reason: your past is my past
Although you are right about setting rates, it is not quite what I am suggesting, I am only wanting to have comparables. ie if you work as an excavator and are self employed, then xxx rate would equate to a paid position. If you want to accept less, then it is indeed up to you, however, by doing so you lose out in the long run.

I have put suggested minima in teh last BAJR pay and conditions document.
Had a very brief look at the stuff on CIS and the governments changes to how contractors and subcontractors are to pay and be paid under it. Does archaeology count as CIS? I couldn't find anything that said it did......although I skimmed through quickly. It seemed to relate to the stuff that happened after the archaeology was done.
I find myself agreeing with Unit on the question of trying to set a rate for self-employed archaeologists. Sure, you can work out comparibles to relate self-employed to paid positions, but it could only ever be advisory, there's no way short of a cartel that you could ensure that no-one would accept work for less. And surely one of the major advantages of being self-employed is the freedom to set your own rate, which will be determined by both what the market will bear (i.e. what the client is prepared to pay, whether that's the landowner or a unit) and the personal circumstances of the archaeologist involved (how much he or she needs to charge to cover costs and make a profit). If a self-employed archaeologist is prepared to work for below minimum wage in order to win a particular job, or if they can afford to undercut competitors because their archaeological costs are subsidised by having a rich spouse who's prepared to support them, that's their perogative. It's probably not particularly healthy for the profession in the long term, as I do accept that it's likely to result in a 'race to the bottom' and a general depression in wages, but it would surely amount to restraint of trade to try to dictate to self-employed archaeologists what they should be charging, as it's for each individual to decide what rates they'll accept.
You know Marcus. He once got lost in his own museum
O h I do agree. that setting pay minima for self employed is fraught. but then... after all, there are set minima for employed. Smile no cries of cartel there. just a realisation that minimum wage is just that.

The BAJR guidelines are recommendations rather than requirements. and all that should be added is that for a person to go below what they would get being employed... why the hell don't they just get a job instead? as rather than being flexible, they are working harder to make less. ! go figure!

You can of course charge what you want... I have my own sliding scale of rates, but I also charge what I am worth. :face-approve: As a buildings archaeologist I charge more than if I am on an eval with little chance of finding anything. When I illustrate I charge more than when I do a school project (cos I am nice)

I am flexible, can choose work and also work too bloody hard! Nobody else to pass on the report to or get the account done... or even get those tenders in... it suits me, but you can bet your bottom dollar, I never charge myself out t less than I would earn !

Restricting trade would be impossible, but if people are charging themselves out at a rate that is less than employed... then WTF! :0 something is seriously wrong there.
What is the situation where an archaeologist wins a contract and then engages SE archaeologists to do the work. Is that not (by the HMRC definition of SE) actually sub-letting the contract? I know that many (but probably not all) archaeological tender exercises specifically forbid the successful tenderer from sub-letting the contract (otherwise we could be in the crazy situation where the contract is re-tendered into ever decreasing smaller parts)...Surely this is something that the IFA should take a policy decision on...

Uo1.... Of course I am an archaeologist!!. Maybe not a very successful or high profile one, but l am happy to work contracts and more than happy with the post I am currently employed at and the 'paltry' salary I receive....but I am more than happy to champion the cause of those archaeologists who are less well off and less than happy with their employment lot.
With peace and consolation hath dismist, And calm of mind all passion spent...
BAJR Wrote:O h I do agree. that setting pay minima for self employed is fraught. but then... after all, there are set minima for employed. Smile no cries of cartel there. just a realisation that minimum wage is just that.

But then not every company pays these minima, so if it was a cartel, it'd be a pretty crap one!

BAJR Wrote:and all that should be added is that for a person to go below what they would get being employed... why the hell don't they just get a job instead? as rather than being flexible, they are working harder to make less. !

Possibly because there are not that many jobs out there at the moment? I know a number of people who've gone down the self-employed route over the last three years, and the impetus for all of them was being let go by a unit, then not being able to pick up work with another as easily as would have been the case pre-2008. Some are earning less than they did when they were employed, some more, but all took the view that it would be better to be earning something as a self-employed archaeologist than just sitting around and signing on while waiting for a job with the next unit.
You know Marcus. He once got lost in his own museum
Quote:[SIZE=3]Of course I am an archaeologist!!.

I blame this utter load of rubbish.

last revised 2008. Nowhere does it say how self employed archaeologists are supposed to get on with other archaeologists. In fact the code doesn?t like to use the word self and archaeologist only about ten times in the body of the text. Instead it uses the word member. Members are mentioned 40 times in this text. Now they didn?t always use the word member in this code this has been brought in recently to my understanding.

What the sneaky little plonkers did was to go through the text and replace all the ?An archaeologists? with ?A member?

Luckily concerned this lot have kept a copy of a previous version of the text

WHY Kevin thinks that he is an archaeologist I don?t know but it now appears that he might like to claim to be a member, possibly you can be both but possibly not.

The big question is What is a member?

There is a apendum to the code
Which tells us

Quote:1 A curator is here regarded as a person or organisation
responsible for the conservation and management of
archaeological evidence by virtue of official or statutory
2 A brief here means a framework for a project; a
specification means a detailed statement of the necessary
works associated with the undertaking of a particular
project; both are normally prepared by or agreed with the
relevant curator.
But it does not tell us what a member is

and it also does not tell us how a member should get on with other members. THIS IS THE PROBLEM.

You can go and look at the code of conduct but again there does not seem to be much member on member action, some aspirational nay rubbish on employment rights of employees, colleagues and helpers. Colleagues and helpers?

They don?t like to give the term archaeologist away.

Kev could you be a helpful colleague.
Reason: your past is my past
you seem not to recognise what a member is! didnt you used to be a member unit? is it better being an ex-member? can you re-member? have you dismembered? are you then eunoch? i understand this causes terrible hormonal imbalance
If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don't have to worry about answers

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