Advice on Kit for first time digger

[MarkR]

Hi,
I'm about to start my first ever dig and I was wondering what the best type of gear to get is - I know that the trowel I should get is the WHS 4 inch, but what about waterproofs? I'll be working at loch lomond so I imagine it'll be pretty wet, so should I go for gortex rather than nylon? I know goretex is much more expensive, but I've seen some pretty good deals on military surplus gear and was wondering if there is an advantage to any particular gear when doing fieldwork.

Thanks to anyone can help, and to everyone whos bothered to read this far :)

[BAJR Host]

kneepads! trust me - you do not want knees f##ked by the time you are 30

Army surplus is good because it does not matter too much if you trash em.

Bright yellow thick waterproofs are good as well.

carry your own kit at all times... pen, pencils (2H -5H) rubber, line level, plumb bob, marker pen, ... you should never let them out your sight... and believe me.. although people might wonder why you are carrying them... pretty soon they will be begging to borrow them just for a second...

As to the waterproofs again... sweating in waterproofs is not a nice experieince... but then... if it raining too hard. you will not be working anyway.

Is this the GUARD dig?

[Mole]

If you are working at Loch Lomond then midge repellent is a must (I haven't found any that is a total success but cheap version that works as well as the rest is lemon juice in water - make it quite strong, put it in a old sports drink bottle and slap it on!). Mind you the midges might not be to bad this time of year.

Oh the other thing is thick socks for boots/wellies - even if the weather is good (helps avoid blisters or chaffing)

[disheartened]

good waterproofs and big thick socks. Thermos & big lunch box full of nice food to make everyone jealous at breaktime (or to stave off the ravening hunger that will strike)!

[Beardstroker]

Gortex's stuff is well worth investing in, in my opinion. Granted it is more expensive but if you look after it, it should serve you well for a few winters. I've also found it tends to "breathe" a lot better then other stuff, even the very expensive stuff.

[the invisible man]

Are you taking the high road or the low road? (sorry)

I heartily endorse BAJR's advice on your own little kit box. I would add a hand tape and a penknife to that, and some string if there's room. Needless to say everything should be marked with your name/initials/ID mark (well maybe not the string).

I prefer outer clothing that can be got on or off quickly and easily, which suggests a zippy jacket. Pully over jackets don't have zips for rain to come in though....

[troll]

check out the 101 (nearly) tips for new trenchies....:D

[MarkR]

Thanks everyone for your replies - BAJR, yes it is the GUARD dig, I'm really looking forward to it but a little nervous about arriving and finding myself horribly unprepared[:I]

I was just going to buy some cheap 'mac in a sack' style jacket and overtrousers but I figured I'd be as well paying a bit extra for something that can breath and will likely last longer.

Aside from the army surplus goretex (as I cant afford the high street stuff) what other waterproofs should I consider?

[charlie farnsbarnes]

Every piece of waterproof clothing I've ever bought to wear on site has very quickly been torn. I don't think it's worth spending a fortune on it. If it's not raining heavily, then you'll quickly dry off, if it is heavy, go and stand under a tree or something till it stops. I'd say a good pair of boots is the best thing to spend your money on, and if you haven't worked on site before, some hand cream for when the skin on your fingers starts to crack would be worthwhile.

[troll]

buy yourself a family pack of condoms-only sure fire way of keeping the mobile phone dry!Also- any sunflower-based cooking oil-soak the inside of your boots in it in successive soak/let dry events.will waterproof them.If you smoke-buy a zippo.:D

[MarkR]

lol, well my phones a piece of crap anyway so I dont care if it gets wet - the oiling the boots sounds like its worth a try though - thanks.

I was thinking of getting some waterproof breathable boot-liners but this sounds much cheaper:)

[BAJR Host]

The final look should be somewhere between an Afghan tribesman (circa 1875) and a paramilitary unit from Angola.

Fingerless gloves are always handy to have... but reinforce the palm as the trowel is an unforgiving beast!

plus... make sure that H&S is implemented onsite.. see BAJR guide

www.bajr.org/Documents/HSAdvice.pdf

have you been shown how to shovel? or mattock
I ripped my back when I wa seventeen... never healed!

plus... I hope this a training dig..

most of all take a spare liver.:D

[Oxbeast]

"buy yourself a family pack of condoms-only sure fire way of keeping the mobile phone dry!Also- any sunflower-based cooking oil-soak the inside of your boots in it in successive soak/let dry events.will waterproof them.If you smoke-buy a zippo."

!!What kind of family did you have??
but seriously, buy a £3 digital watch from Argos. All others get knackered. Make sure your steelies are comfortable. I just got some from TK Maxx for £30, reduced from £85. Bargain.
Army surplus Goretex is a good idea, but I find the pockets on the British stuff isn't big enough. Get Dutch stuff

And I hear those Weegies like a bit of a sing-song, so bring your singing voice....

[the invisible man]

"A family pack of condoms....."

Surely that's a contradication in terms???:D[:I]

[Beer Beast]

Work for a company that gives you free high quality PPE including waterproofs, wellies and a trowel.

[voice of reason]

Make sure you get what any employer should provide as a minimum - GUARD must supply waterproofs and suitable (ie steel toe-capped) footwear. Gloves if necessary. Welfare must include hot and cold water available at all times and somewhere to dry your clothes overnight. You must get a site induction for Health and Safety and ask to see the Risk Assessment.

Not sure if you are being paid for this but even as a volunteer they have the same responsibilities to provide PPE. they cannot make you pay for it either - although they can ask for it back at the end of the project. Frankly, though, we have never asked for boots to be returned!

Enjoy

[the invisible man]

I have never known a training dig to provide footwear, waterproofs or gloves! Come to that I've never come across hot water either, other than a kettle.

[charlie farnsbarnes]

The Loch Lomond site isn't a training excavation, it's a fully commercial dig.

[BAJR Host]

Forsooth Charlie... what would you be suggesting!! [:0]



BAJR is looking into this... but gently.. [:I]

[troll]

Ref the three quid Argos watches....naah, get youself a Casio G-Shock mate. Had mine for two years now-puts up with heavy shock, rain/snow/sludge and shi**. Family pack condoms are for those among us with a bit of an appetite. Mobile phones have a nasty habit of tearing the cheaper jobbies...scary thought....also don`t forget to remove phone from said jobbie when answering it-looks a little odd.:D

[the invisible man]

So - chatting away on the mobile when you should be working, eh, Troll? Shame on you, defrauding your noble and illustrious employers like that!:D :D:D

[Mykhell]

Usefull advice that , , how far are you travelling to Loch Lomond? Is there nothing you could get closer to your home, i'm also going on my first dig in June, Bollihope County Durham i'll heed the advice on what i'll need and forget it nearer the time, everyones got to have a beginning.

[troll]

Invisible- aaah well, you see, matters of national importance ya know....only durin breaks and...not whilst mattocking..and things..B)

[BAJR Host]

This whole thing raises teh issue of the chicken and the egg.

If it is questionable to have newbies on a commercial excavation .. then how do you get experience on working on a commercial dig..?

Talking of closer. My first site was in a cave in the Wye Valley... was only 13 and was soon to learn teh harsh hedonistic realities of archaeology...ooooooooooh me liver.[xx(]

[the invisible man]

Of course you've got to start somewhere, as with any trade or profession, newcomers have to be trained, whether they're graduates or have one GCSE grade F in media studies. I don't see the problem with having newbies on a commercial dig, I see a problem with not paying them. I see a problem with an industry expecting other parties, presumably competitors and/or universities, to train staff to a practical commercial standard so the can reap the commercial benefit, instead of taking a fair share of the responsibilty.

As for you starting when you were 13, BAJR, blimey, the archaeology was only just buried wasn't it? Still warm?:D

[BAJR Host]

Still warm... ya cheeky begger... At least it was easier back then as I could still ask living people what they used the stone tools for!

[:0]

[Mykhell]

Looking at this another way , my qualifications in Archaeology will hopefully be a decent graded AS level ( exam June 9th)For 20 years or more i've had jobs/ or experience in gardening , groundwork , landscaping , dry stone walling , footpath repair in the Cumbrian fells ,which will be the most usefull on an archaeological site? my work history or an AS level at a decent grade? as for midge repellent half a cup of paraffin drank once a week keeps the blighters away ( straight up? but not much use for smokers i admit)}:)

[BAJR Host]

Good Point Mykhell, however... would you let me build a drystone wall.. just because I excavated one once. It is tricky, but I feel that training excavations that provide a high level of supervision are more appropriate starting places .. as are local group digs ... where time can be taken, no rush no deadlines no tricky descisions having to be made.

I have seen people shovel through a graveyard ... it takes experience to feel the difference between a slightly gritty friable grey silty sand and a mortar inclusion within a grey sandy silt. It is unfair to expect someone to be able to do that right away. only after a few good sites. I would be unhappy (as a County Archaeologist) if I knew that a site was being dug by people of less than 3 month experience. -

All very tricky indeed.

Transferable skills yes... but thrown into the deep end can end in drowning.

Commercial archaeology is a whole different ball game from gentle volly digs. As many here can say.

[Curator Kid]

I don't have a problem with some staff on commercial sites having less experience, as long as they and the site is properly supervised, and there are adequate amounts of qualified & experienced personnel around on site to guide the newbies. Everyone must start somewhere - my first ever job in archaeology was as a digger on a commercial PPG16 site, and I profited from the experience of those I was working with. What I do worry about however, is where units may use a number of less experienced staff on the same site, paying them less (one assumes)so they can try to undercut the opposition and win the jobs.

[the invisible man]

Exactly. There is an obvious problem if experienced staff only are allowed on a commercial site! How else do you get experienced staff?????

Clearly, a sensible ratio of experienced/trainee personnel, appropriate to the particular site, is essential. Staffing numbers should be sufficient to allow time for supervision of newbies. This is good for archaeology, good for archaeologists new and err, not so new, and in the long term, good for the industry (the employers). Maybe, and it's a forlorn and desperate hope, being a requirement of the condition that adequate and appropriate staff are allocated to a job, this could be interpreted as including a number of "trainees" I don't know, say, 5 or 10%?

So, it will all start next week then......................

Blimey, that pig was low, nearly took my chimney off.......

[BAJR Host]

Nice thought there Invisible.... worth thinking about.

mind out for them thar pigs though... there seems to be a lot about

[Beki]

Tis a good point, I started out on training digs while i was doing A levels to make sure I like field work, then at university i spent every summer at training digs and a whole year on work placement in commercial units to make sure the I knew what I was doing before i graduated!

I now feel that I am well prepared...

But I know that not everyone has the opportunity to do it the way I did.

[deepdigger]

Goretex is good but bloody expensive, i've found that it all gets ruined by washing anyway. buy cheaper (dickies) waterproofs, get em really dirty wash em a few times then bin em.
good boots should be top of your list, if your boots are not comfortable you can't work.
knee pads, i know you look a nutter in them but its better than knackered knees.
a good quality hard hat, and write your name on the inside not the outside.


deep

[Digger]

Pack a few bin bags (large type), they come in handy for your sodden gear, also great to throw your steel caps into rather than losing friends by tracking copious amounts of mud through their vehicles. They can also double as emergency rain gear when your caught short.

[Oxbeast]

Goretex can be cheap. Military goretex is the real stuff, and quite tough. Its always waterproof, except when it starts to get really old. It doesn't breathe too well when covered by mud.

Theres an army surplus stall near me that does a jacket & trousers combo for £25. Makes you look german, mind.

[deepdigger]

The problem with army surplus cammo gear is that come tea time nobody can find you!

deep

[Beki]

Unless your working in a desert (sandy place not cakes..)

Charity shops are great for cheap jumpers..they keep you warm but you don't feel guilty about ruining them....plus, you're giving money to charity...

[lucy78green]

I found good quality mounaineering fleeces in TK Maxx for about £20 reduced from £60 - trouble is one went missing and I had to go and buy a new one. They also had flourescent yellow fleeces that weren't as good quality, but I decided I didn't want bright yellow everything....

Lucy

[deepdigger]

tk's is a good shop for work clothes. a goodly line of jumpers cheap too.

deep

[the invisible man]

I used to have a cammo jacket but I can't find it.

Today, Bradford. Tomorrow, well, Bradford probably.

[deepdigger]

must be good cammo!!

deep

[Gemma]

hmmm... main problem I have for my first dig is getting from East Anglia, 3 stops on London underground and all the way to wales... with a tent, roll matt, toolkit, and a months worth of clothes, teabags and fags. could be a little hairy! [:p]

[lucy78green]

Get a good backpack, fraid the job involves treking all over the place for work, and as a person who can't drive working out the public transport system, variety of youth hostels and availablility of laundrettes in advance is a must!

Lucy

[star-nosed mole]

Primark do the best combats (mens but they fit me too) - I have two pairs and the knees haven't given up on me yet!

Also - biggest tip ever, get that golden driving license.

[the invisible man]

Gemma, where you're going you won't need to take much in the way of victuals as food is provided. They have a little shop on the campsite (well ok it's a trestle table) where you can buy choccies and stuff, plus cider, Guinness or Red Dragon. There is a launderette in Newport, and someone is bound to have a car. You won't need much toolkit either, take the minimum if you have to carry it - just your trowel is fine, the other bits and bobs described on this thread are handy and should fit in a very small box but are not essentail for your fist dig.

Travel light!

Today, Bradford. Tomorrow, well, Bradford probably.

[vulpes]

Primark do the best combats !!!

Yes Primark, as used and endorsed by armies the world over...

[troll]

Think I put this up on another thread but...layer the inside of your boots with olive oil/sunflower oil. leave to dry inbetween layers, apply with bath sponge. Waterproofs yer boots and! makes yer toes smell of chips. Also, rewaxing spray for barbour-type jackets can be used on most articles of clothing-same again, allow to dry between layers (just don`t breathe the stuff whilst spraying).:D

[BAJR Host]

Did anyone say plasters?

Another day another WSI…

[amber]

tip for generously endowed females:

do not wear pale t-shirts on dry and dusty sites in particular. You will end up with two circular splodges of dust on the peaks of certain prominant parts!

it looks very silly and will amuse your supposedly mature/professional male friends enormasly.

You have been warned.

[troll]

wear pale t-shirts on dry and dusty sites-sorry, forgot that one.

[deepdigger]

And frequently damp down the aforementioned dry and dusty area with copious amounts of water!!
Please!

deep

[BAJR Host]

While we are on the subject... er..... ahem...

will men of any endownment please never wear shorts on sites.. the view of a "squashed prawn" is never enjoyable.. less when you are trying to eat yer lunch!
[xx(]

Another day another WSI…

[Beardstroker]

And the same stricture about shorts should also apply to those of both sexes who have bad varicose veins:(

[achingknees]

"the view of a "squashed prawn" is never enjoyable.. less when you are trying to eat yer lunch!"

Cheers BAJR - prawn sarnie straight in the bin :(